I’m going to flat out say this: I haven’t read the Charley Rosen “Deron Williams is better than CP” column.
I know, right? Amazing self-restraint… or is it just that I find it difficult to summon up the will to care about a piece of writing I know isn’t backed up by statistical fact, written by a guy — who works for Fox– who has had a penchant in the past for watching one Hornets game a year (usually a blowout loss) and making sweeping generalizations based on that one game? I think Rosen spent most of last season on my $#*tList. Because I have a deep and abiding hatred for him? No, because he just sucks. “Williams goes left better than Paul”? Is this basketball, or fucking Zoolander?
I dunno. You go read it if you want. Or instead you could check out this post by Rob Fitz of Celtics 17 to see how Chris stacks up to Magic and Stockton. Or you could just look at this:
2006
Paul:
16 points
8 assists
5 rebounds
2 steals
2.3 TO
Williams:
10 points
5 assists
2 rebounds
1 steal
1.8 TO
2007
Paul:
17 points
9 assists
4 rebounds
3 steals
2.5 TO
Williams:
16 points
9 assists
3 rebounds
1 steal
3.0 TO
2008
Paul:
21 points
12 assists
4 rebounds
3 steals
2.5 TO
Williams:
19 points
11 assists
3 rebounds
1 steal
3.4 TO
2009
Paul:
21 points
11 assists
5 rebounds
3 steals
2.9 TO
Williams:
19 points
11 assists
3 rebounds
1 steal
3.4 TO
FG% on 2-point jump shots this season:
Paul 47.4 percent, Williams 47.2 percent.
FG% on 3-pointers this season:
Paul 34.1 percent, Williams 31.9 percent.
FG% on inside shots this season:
Paul 63.1 percent, Williams 56.5 percent.
And 1’s this season:
Paul 31, Williams 19
(Thanks, Hornets Report and Hornets 24/7.)
When will it end? When? When? (UPDATE: Apparently never. Whatever. Ryne Nelson can’t really hide the fact that he’s laughably biased against Chris Paul at this point. In fact, I don’t even know why I linked to that. It killed brain cells. It literally had nothing to add except, “Haha! I found someone who thinks I’m not wrong.” UPDATE TO THE UPDATE: Hollinger knows.)
WTF!
I was just looking at rob petersons version of who is better, people keep saying williams does better against Paul but that is clearly a matchup thing, a lot of great players had someone they struggled against for one reason or another. Paul has some troubles due to the size difference just as we have issues against the jazz because they are a bigger more physical team but it’s just all about matchups. I’m not worried I just hope we do better against those damn jazz cause frankly I’m tired of comparing pointguards because their team is doing well. Freaking annoying, like bryant in the race for mvp when pau gasol won western conference player of the month, the month, not a lot of months in an nba season so he apparently has enough help.
To quote Charley Rosen from circa 2003:
“Don’t get caught in the LeBron James pipe dream. The best King James can ever be is an average NBA player.”
That is all.
HAHAHA.
There is so much douchitude in that forum, I almost passed out from the vinegar.
Just looking at the raw numbers, CP3 has just a slight advantage over Deron. You could give Williams extra points for being taller, but he’s also slower and less prone to drive the lane and commit a foul.
The best way to look at it, I think, is to see where each team would be without their respective point guards. The Jazz have a long and successful history dating back to the late 1980s. Jerry Sloan has created an institution in Utah and Williams is (obviously) not his first talented floor general. Also, with Okur, Boozer, Kirelenko, Paul Millsap and Ronnie Brewer, Williams has a much stronger supporting cast (just look at how they did when he was injured).
Now, if the Hornets didn’t have Paul, where do you think they’d be?
Exactly.
I wasn’t going to read the article, until the Jazz twitter feed called it a good one; so I read it and retorted over in tweet-land. Listen, most media people are lazy; like TT6 said, they see one game and think they know. Maybe the assignment they got wasn’t what they wanted. Who knows? But there is no contest. CP3 was the runner up to the MVP last year, and had better numbers than Steve Nash in either of his MVP seasons. As for Deron? Hasn’t even made the all-star game. See also the numbers above. Game over.
I don’t really buy the All Star Game argument, even as a CP supporter. Deron’s stats blew those of the East guards pretty much out of the water. If he wasn’t in CP’s conference, he’d have been an All Star. It ought to be DW/CP/TP every year as soon as other more well-known guards retire.
“Williams goes left better than Paul”? Is this basketball, or fucking Zoolander?
ROLFMFAO!!!
People keep pointing out size but isn’t just about every point guard bigger than CP3? There’s nothing new there.
Listen, I’m not saying Deron isn’t a great baller. He is. But that said, things are what they are. That he could be in an all-star in the East is a bogus argument. If there was no Michael Jordan, Malone and Stockton would have rings. If there was no Tim Duncan, Shaq would have three MVPs. But there are. So no rings for the Jazz, and historical anomaly for the Shaqtus. It happens.
As for size, it’s a stupid argument. Eddy Curry’s bigger than Tyson. Haslem’s bigger than West. Want to make either trade? So Deron’s bigger than CP. Who cares? Size implies certain advantages, but in itself means nothing. It’s like saying Erick Dampier is better than Peja because he’s bigger. They have different games, you can’t necessarily compare them; the same goes for even guys that play the same position, but have different style (like Peja and Ju-Ju). Or take the converse: you can’t say Lebron is better than Marvin Williams (Hawks tie-in) because he’s bigger. Of course, Lebron is better. But it’s not because he’s bigger.
Honestly, these articles are lazy journalism. The Jazz and Hornets are both on winning streaks right now, they both have young, talented point guards, so these dudes just think that’s something to write about. It’s not. It’s coincidence. CP is way better now than D-Will ever will be. Watching CP is like watching history be made. You can’t say that about many players. And certainly not about Williams.
after watching a game where absolutely nothing was called and they said it was good defense. The hawks practically mobbed Ju Ju on one play with three guys literally pulling him to the floor, The announcers said Dwest was off his game when he kept driving and getting hit hard with no calls whatsoever no wonder we couldn’t come back in this game.
D West having no free throws and 20 boards was weird in an unheard-of way. Dude was literally getting NO calls, even though he got clubbed in the paint a couple times. Damn the refs for ruining his 20/20 game…
TT6:”It ought to be DW/CP/TP every year as soon as other more well-known guards retire.”
I’ve heard your objection to fan voting before, but surely you don’t mean Kobe gets in on past glory. I agree he would if it ever came to that, but as it is I would think he would be a starter based on merit alone. What two guards from the West would you put on the floor before him? — and do they do the big ball dance?
I was actually thinking more of older PGs like Billups/Nash/Iverson, to name some names over the last couple of years who DW has been statistically better than or arguably even with. I separate positions in my head even if the All Star voting doesn’t. There have been 3 point guards on the West team for the last 3 years straight.
I think Brandon Roy will start an All Star game the year after Kobe retires, even if he eventually becomes the most productive 2 guard. I expect that. As I expect CP and Kobe will be starting together for a while still.
I think Deron Williams is a great player. His game will translate through the ages, and in my mind’s eye I can see him playing Walt Frazier and Pete Maravich competitively. The only difference is Chris Paul is a history making player. I believe the only way this gets settled for a little while is a playoff series, with both teams going full tilt. In the playoffs, we focus on the Jazz’s array of cuts and see if Okur can make contested 3s. The Jazz will try to neutralize pick’n'roll with Chandler, but will they have to sacrifice our wings shooting well.
I’ll never talk smack about DWill: he’s creative, clutch and a great leader for his team. Chris Paul is simply more dynamic, and that’s saying a lot because Williams is an exciting player.
For Rosen to buy into ideas that stats don’t back up, like Chris Paul isn’t as good a shooter; that’s just lazy journalism and tt6 shot it down like the slow-footed booby-trapped skeet shooting target it is.